Happy Birthday, Newspoll.
Howard, Howard govt - - Posted on August, 7 at 12:22 pm by Aussie Bob
In case you’re wondering what the “0.00″ means, it’s simple.
0.00% is the Howard government’s winning strike rate over the past twelve months of Newspoll. They have not won a single Newspoll since the poll conducted over the weekend of August 12th to 13th, 2006.
I could get snarky and say that the slump in Howard’s “Preferred PM” ratings back from 44/43 to 45/39 disproves Dennis Shanahan’s chartist theory of Prime Ministerial Resurgence. Remember? “Old dogs”, “young dogs”, “sausage sizzles” and the smell of frying onions in the morning? But it would be churlish to gloat… Judging by his on-line blog article today, things are gloomy enough at chez Shanahan. It seems that bragging how well he understands Newspoll “because we own it” doesn’t quite cut the mustard as much as it used to.
Today I content myself with wishing Newspoll and the Coalition political savants who’ve brought their beloved party to its present sorry state a hearty “Happy Birthday”, maybe popping a bottle of bubbly tonight and saying to Little Johnny that at his next place of abode there’ll be sign above the door reading:
“Welcome to the Matt Talbot hostel for homeless politicians”.
Bye, bye, Man Of Steel…
Posted in Howard, Howard govt |
August 7th, 2007 at 12:51 pm
Hey Aussie Bob
We are counting on you Buddie. I hope and pray and prostrate myself on the Great God Kevvie 07 that you are right.
August 7th, 2007 at 1:15 pm
You’re a cruel man AB, but funny.
August 7th, 2007 at 1:28 pm
Is that a young Andrew Peacock rubbing his chin and smiling on the right of the photo?
August 7th, 2007 at 2:57 pm
Out of superstition and past disappointments I’ve avoided gloating, and there’s still a few months to go. Keep focused people.
In some ways I wish it were otherwise. I’d like, like Lefty E, to really enjoy the suffering they must be experiencing at present. But I daren’t. All the same, it is hard to see any comeback from here.
How many more sleeps before election night?
August 7th, 2007 at 3:37 pm
Totally off-topic for which I apologise. I’ve only posted this because a lot of RTS fans often mention Virginia Trioli (ABC 702 Radio Sydney)
702 in surprise ratings crash
http://www.smh.com.au/news/tv–radio/702-cops-a-beating/2007/08/07/1186252678408.html
I am not in the least bit surprised.
August 7th, 2007 at 4:32 pm
Let’s just hope it’s not a rerun (sans the sex) of “Don’s Party”.
August 7th, 2007 at 5:31 pm
Matt Talbot is for rock choppers. The Rodent, is a Rat of Principle. Honest to goodness, non-core Principle. And loyal to his prostestant roots. He’d try for a bunk at the Sally’s first.
August 7th, 2007 at 6:02 pm
And he’s decided this afternoon that he’ll sponsor a plebiscite for any Qld council who want one to test the amalgamations there. Every other state has already been through this process.
And he will provide money to bail out a timber mill whose employees are mostly residents of Eden-Monaro (another marginal).
I am beginning to wonder if the man is still in charge of his full faculties. Perhaps we could have him analysed by a competent authority?
August 7th, 2007 at 7:32 pm
BigRuss, you are thinking within the boundaries of what a person with any measure of principle would do, and therefore what Howard is engaging in appears to be insane or demented, however Howard is a man for whom principle isn’t in his lexicon, and at this time his beloved position/status is in jeopardy in spite of the araldite; prepare for worse even!
AB, your comment and the return of your clever, consonant graphic has bucked me up immensely - oh, how I wish that Howard is destined to such an end - sadly a cushy number will be his no matter how the next election pans out. Never mind you’ve spurred a dream….
August 7th, 2007 at 7:45 pm
The polls do not necessarily suggest a foregone conclusion, if you check Oz Politics “chicken entrails”. Howard can make it maybe if he holds off until the end of December.
August 7th, 2007 at 9:15 pm
Interesting that you mention the mill bail out Big Russ. As a resident of Bombala I am none too thrilled about this politically expedient decision by the minister for opening envelopes.
This bail out for a mill in the suburb of Hume,the management of which has been nothing if not incompetent is pork barrelling in the extreme, but this idiotic git that is the local member has done nothing to address the reasons for its failure, and yet again left the people of Bombala without much needed infrastucure to keep our kids in this small town. And I find it truly offensive that a company that owes a substantial amount to Forest NSW and breaks its contract for timber supply should be propped up by an ever more desparate Govt.
August 8th, 2007 at 12:14 am
The other precious morsel in Shanahan’s “analysis” is the way he uses a figure of 49% to support the claim that voters have approved of the Government’s expulsion of Haneef.
Back when I was at school, 49% was a minority. But I will say no more - as we know, Dennis has a superior, ineffable, intuitive, Obewan-like understanding of Newspoll that simply cannot be imparted to we ordinary, mortal non-News Ltd employees.
August 8th, 2007 at 2:19 am
Howard has almost left the scene…but I saw the face of a future Australian totalitarian leader tonight, heard the voice of someone on the verge of insanity.
Someone willing to risk crushing the Rights & lifestyle of innocent people in order to catch a few criminals, right a few wrongs…in all probability to fulfil his own prejudiced ambitions, ease his own traumas & perhaps find redemption.
I observed a man convincing himself & others he is out to ‘do good’…but is in fact on a personal Crusade similar to that of George W. Bush…& we know how that turned out…how the evidence against a people was distorted & abused & fictionalised in order to fulfill his dogmatic & loopy goals.
I saw the eyes of a bully pretending to be a saviour.
Watched the tight lips of a man who will eventually stop at nothing to bring the Australian population to its moral knees, to transform them into obedient servants of HIS so called ‘enlightened’ Government.
I saw a man rage with intention…with a ‘Grand Plan’…driven by an intention to ensure that not only do Aborigines across this Nation act EXACTLY as HE & his MASTERS see fit…but act like WHITE FELLAS…BE eventually WHITE FELLAS.
This man, this self-proclaimed ‘protector of the children’, this ‘Righter of all things Evil’, gave him self away tonight on Lateline, with the assistance of Tony Jones…
…this man demonstrated how truly frightening his inner drive is…how crazed his goals are…as he snorted thru his nose & barked out his views…his orders…like a Sergeant ripping into his recruits.
This man it seems is from military stock, who by his attitude & blind determination obviously puts the way of the army over the ways of Democracy…as has Pervez Musharraf in Pakistan.
His name is Mal Brough.
Individuals with such power, particularly representing the people in a Democracy, who demonstrate such unbridled rage & obvious desire to control every eventuality at any cost…these Moral Crusaders…they MUST have their pasts & contacts scrutinised.
Failure to do so could lead this Country down a path of civil conflict & right’s abuses the likes of which we’ve never seen.
imho, for a Government…
assisting children should be brought about by ongoing respect for communities…ensuring appropriate & affordable services…providing them with a media that demonstrates balance and assists in promoting the positives and benefits of a community rather than pointing out year in & year out the negatives for the selfish financial and political aims of an ELITE FEW…
assisting children means applying firm but kind pressure if some aspects of a community go wayward…& listening thruout to the populace of that community…acting before problems become too entrenched, rather than taking knee-jerk, politically advantageous & Paternalistic action…
helping children is about compromise & respecting, learning about cultural diversity and providing opportunities for that community to express its uniqueness, talent & abilities for the benefit of both the Community and its surrounds…it’s about Governments demonstrating consistent interest in the welfare of a child’s community, providing jobs & treating their parents & guardians w/ respect.
It’s about consistent RESPECT & CARE & LISTENING & RESPONDING.
It’s not about MISSIONS…& CRUSADES.
and INTENTIONAL NEGLIGENCE
The Iraq War fiasco should have taught us by now to be extremely wary of Moral Crusaders.
N’
August 8th, 2007 at 8:55 am
Most eloquently put, nasking. The post is a timely reminder, if any is needed, that no matter how hilarious the stuffups of the past week or so, this is a serious business.
We need to rely on the pragmatism of the Australian people, and I think they are pretty good on sorting out wheat from chaff, to see through these desperate and shameless shams.
August 8th, 2007 at 9:27 am
Excellently well put Naz. I got the same impression.
The man’s mad.
You could see a sort of insane fire in his eyes. When he started raving about police “first securing the ground” the look on his face was psychotic.
He was like some mad missionary full of fire and brimstone, out to save the kanakas, consumed by his own moral zeal.
Truly a frightening interview. Tony egged him on rather nicely.
August 8th, 2007 at 10:15 am
Yes Nasking, of such stuff are deranged control freaks made. Military Mal had on Lateline the demeanour of a low-rent sadist and the wild eyes of the zealot. Not once did Brough engage in argument with Tony Jones, he just regurgitated the desperate rhetoric of his Generalissimo, El Rodente.
The guy is a fucken cretin. Anyone else notice how he wants to raise the “life expectations” of NT indigenous kids as part of the shock and awe health initiative. People apparantly seek medical help all the time to improve their “life expectations”. Will all client/patients be given free copies of Charles Dickens with every forced consultation?
Mal knows what’s best “these people”, as he referred to them. The paternaistic swine reminded me of what white attitudes used to be like under Apartheid in South Africa.
August 8th, 2007 at 10:17 am
Brough is uncannily reminiscent of Captain Peter Debnam, another humourless disciplinarian who used to rant about ‘Middle Eastern thugs’ who’d turned parts of Sydney into a war zone. Hopefully they never got past junior rank in the army because the army sussed out their unfitness for command. It’s a bit rough on the Aborigines to let Brough work out his fantasies of running a military operation on them though.
They are the face of the neo-cons taking over the Liberal Party: mad moral zealots convinced we’re all going soft and need Strong Leadership and a Return to Christian Values.
August 8th, 2007 at 12:18 pm
**Lieutenant** Peter Debnam, formerly of the RAN.
August 8th, 2007 at 1:09 pm
Oops, yes, sorry Sean. Debnam’s just a forgettable kind of guy.
August 8th, 2007 at 1:57 pm
This bit from Brough on Lateline made me sit up:
WTF? Since when did white fellas lose welfare payments if their kids don’t go to school (I assume that’s what he means by the obscure reference to ’cause and effect’)?
It clearly wasn’t a bit of sloppy expression at the end of a long day because he said it again later:
Is he trying to kid indigenous people that this already happens in the rest of the community, or trying to kid people concerned about discrimination that this is just a move to equality, or what? Maybe in HowardWorld they’ve got to the stage where talking points have completely parted company with the real world and ministers just say anything that sounds impressive, even if it is literally meaningless.
August 8th, 2007 at 3:37 pm
Spot on nasking… again you put into words what I want to say…
I was screaming at the TV last night watching Lateline - using words would get me expelled from the Labor party and unions, but probably not the Liberal party
August 8th, 2007 at 3:40 pm
Well said, Nasking.
Brough is control-freak crazy.
August 8th, 2007 at 3:43 pm
Thanks Nas for your timely and graphic observations with regards to Capn. Brough. I have become over time, not only extremely concerned over the rise and rise of the Opus Dei type inquisitorial Catholics within the Coalition hierachy, but also in the seeming ease in which they are accomplishing their extremely active presence. And yes, I have read up on the 1930’s, off and on to present time, ‘Lyon’s Group’.
In a country that now sees so few of its population owning to such right wing theorocratic/inquisitorial belief systems (AusStats), how and why are so many of the electorate acquiesing in allowing these types gain control of the legislature?
It would appear that we so quickly lose the appetite for social justice rights when it applies to those who have been successfully storied as Other. To then have (as with Brough last night) cast the responsibility/blame onto other members (women - mothers, aunties and grandmothers) of the demonised group for the authorship of the plan to remove their hard fought for land, welfare, self governing, rights made me weep with despair. Can you imagine what punishments might be metered out to those women now they have been singled out publicly as personally responsible?
No wonder the two authors of the NT Government report ‘Little Children are Sacred’ (though with none of its 90 odd recommendations for redress being utilised), that apparently was the catalyst for this so-called “major emergency”, are so desperately angry and ‘pissed off’.
That Labor is going along with this project in spite of their noted fundamental concerns makes me so very sad. Kev07’s desire not to be wedged is understandable, but this is going beyond the pale! I noted Warren Snowden (federal member for those Aborigines so maligned and disenfranchised) sitting on the opposition’s front bench, as Kruddy was rationalising Labor’s excuses for acquiesance to the three Bills. I’m not sure whether Snowden was being courageous, showing solidarity, or being foolhardy, but his face and body language demonstrated his immense discomforture and pain.
The slowly boiled frog syndrome (that has been discussed at length on so many other threads on RTS) seems to demonstrate how easy it is to allow such non democratic/dictatorial systems bud, flower and seed.
BTW, child sexual and/or physical abuse is meted out to white children (1 in 3 girls, 1 in 7 boys) probably as much if not more than in Aboriginal children - certainly not 1 in 3 of those 500 Aboriginal children medically examined in the NT to date have been shown to have sexual abuse signs and symptoms - yet I don’t see troops, the AFP, or indeed, volunteer medical or social work teams marching down any of our suburban streets anytime soon - why is that? When, apparently, it’s Capn Brough’s sworn duty, ‘as a father’ being his rational, to protect Australia’s children - well if they are Aboriginal and live on large land holdings with a current market value, at any rate.
Oh, and it’s just luvurly for the patriachal ‘mad moral zealots’ (Ken-L)
August 8th, 2007 at 5:14 pm
Just give them time. They’ll use radio jocks & a Bill O’Reilly type character…probably via Sky News, to initially spread their condemnation of anyone who ‘potentially’ undermines the ‘moral values’ of the children…
they’ll blame every case of child abuse on the free & easy, sexual liberation, slack ’she’ll be right’ attitude of the late 60s & early 70s, including ROCK n’ ROLL…& the ‘feminist’ movement that flourished under Gough Whitlam…
these ZEALOTS despise CHOICE, they detest women out of the kitchen (or near the BBQ…right Mr. Costello)…they fervently believe that one bun out of the oven means room for another…female enslavement (unless of course it’s their strong-willed gal making mega-bucks for them…at least until MUM tells them otherwise)…
they pretend to love the children…but loving the children means tough & rough discipline, proudly watching the runt of the pack be forced into a War to die for the family name whilst ensuring the CHOSEN children become officers w/ little responsibility, or get a break from conscription via the ‘hallowed halls’ of Uni.
These are MORAL CRUSADERS born in the heart of a Church, a Scout Hall, an Army Barracks, a stern Professor’s office, bent over in the toilet of a school oh so far away from home…& some are created, molded in a musty, austere bedroom locked from the outside by a raging disciplinarian…
these were once children taught to rise above others…forced to read National Geographic for pleasure…taught to accept women as Angels & Moral Guardians & stern, but home cooking Mums…
taught w/ a horse whip not to play w/ the savages down the road…taught to repress their sexual urges & instead rage against others in order to climax…taught never to touch themselves to love themselves to forgive themselves to truly love others because all is SIN…& all shall be punished for their SINS…& only an asking of forgiveness from God by prayer and a chat in a little box…& various forms of self-flagellation, enuff to light the passion & fires of the missionary, can bring peace… will open the gates to the wonder world…
and shoving the heads of homosexual deviants down the toilet might also do the trick…& crushing the hopes & dreams of an alternative, possibly Lesbian daughter by sending her to a school of cruel virgin worshippers, or to the WHITE ROOM for electro-shock therapy to help bring her to her senses.
and as they punish their bikes and legs and wives and friends in Rugby on the oval…and those they see as “savages who need to be integrated & transformed”, they feel the FIRE…& they MOCK…mock & hurl insults at those who are not fit to shine their boots…those who don’t ‘cum’ to the sound of Latin rolling off an old, rigid man’s tongue…those not privy to the GRAND PLAN…
and sometimes, occasionally they let the zeal…the missionary zeal & arrogance break out…
and they reveal the HATE…THE PASSION…beneath.
And when society gives them enuff POWER…they turn the HATE & THE PASSION on like burning lasers…inquisitors…judges…moral purists…lost in a sea of their own FURY…felling sinner by sinner by sinner…transforming child by child by child…until they have a whole new generation of THEM.
Moral Crusaders awaiting their POPE in the year of the Scouts…2008.
And the Left shall be slain. And their Social Revolution burnt, w/ their books & art & music…& beliefs.
AMEN!
August 8th, 2007 at 6:04 pm
Nasers,you should be writing the topics not commenting on them.You are truly wasting your talent here.
August 8th, 2007 at 6:27 pm
But to the topic at hand,This is about working class per se,this is getting in at the base level,the thin end of the wedge.It is about cutting welfare eventually across the board, and getting back the land to let their fucking mates mine it,with out all those interfering elders and other lefty do gooders getting in the road.
They really are pathetic, however what’s worse, there are people out in la la land(that’s the suburbs)who really do believe the bona fides of these bastards.I mean since 1788 we have treated Aboriginals like fucking maggots,and now all of a sudden we have had this epiphany for their welfare.My God, and my wife wants to know why I drink.
August 8th, 2007 at 8:46 pm
Well said all…& Phill, i absolutely luv commenting on RTS & a few other places & have no other aspirations. I feel privileged to be a part of this good ship, this ‘down to earth’ blog, this tavern of discussion, chat & Truth seeking. Every commenter here is superb…& articulate. As are the bloggers who introduce the topics.
And I couldn’t agree more w/ you regarding the goals of some of these Crusaders…because i truly believe that many zealots are actually charlatans…prepared to use moral crusading to gain votes & make money.
Others however, do have the PASSION…the drive of a missionary…or a Patton…& fervently believe in their cause…perhaps insane, perhaps too myopic, perhaps w/ good intentions…but they are often used, exploited by the politicians & money makers…used as the Evangelical Right was by the Rove & Cheney types to gain electoral power, spread the hate message against the Left & true Liberals…& provide cover for these ELITE FEW’s more greedy ventures…including selling arms to whoever will take them…& mining whatever land they can get their hands on, regardless of the effects on the environment & surrounding communities.
These are the same rampant capitalists who convince the media & rural families & schools & churches to indoctrinate younguns in the ways of Patriotism & the Military…whilst carefully constructing conflicts & War zones to send these brainwashed, impulsive, easily swayed young men & women to…asking them to defend the freedom of America, or Australia, or Britain and so on…whilst supplying these naive soldiers w/ every conceivable weapon that they, the ELITE, earn profits from…whilst doing the same for the so called ‘enemy’. And in turn making profits from these ongoing Wars…probably even from the very coffins & funerals & life insurance provided to the many returning dead.
And these grotesque FEW…these manipulative, war-mongering, perfume and cologne bathing, gold consuming, sex mad, sado-masochistic (excellent stuff enemy combatant), lying like a Serb militiamen after a massacre, truth eating, Vlad the Impaler respecting, burrowers beneath contempt…they send YOUR children, your HOPES & DREAMS…& use YOUR taxes to defend places like this:
————–
DUBAI, United Arab Emirates — They still wake before dawn in desert dormitories that pack a dozen men or more to a room. They still pour concrete and tie steel rods in temperatures that top 110 degrees. They still spend years away from families in India and Pakistan to earn about $1 an hour. They remain bonded to employers under terms that critics liken to indentured servitude.
no country is as dependent as the United Arab Emirates, where foreigners make up about 85 percent of the population and 99 percent of the private work force.
An ethos of tolerance has prevailed, with churches, bars and miniskirts co-existing with burqas. But the construction workers who build hotel rooms that rent for $1,000 a night and malls that sell shoes for $1,000 a pair live segregated lives outside of this prosperous, cosmopolitan world.
They rise before dawn in distant camps, work six days a week at guarded sites and return by bus with time to do little but eat or sleep. Their sheer numbers inspire unease. When the film “Syriana” was released here, the government cut a scene of violent labor protest.
“If the U.A.E. wants to be a first-class global player, it can’t just do it with gold faucets and Rolls-Royces,” said Sarah Leah Whitson, the Middle East director for Human Rights Watch. “It needs to bring up its labor standards.”
Acting separately, the emirate of Abu Dhabi has strengthened health benefits and subsidized what is meant to be a model labor camp. Still much about the workers’ lives remains unchanged, including the frequent need to pay high recruiting fees. Mr. Kaabi said that practice was hard to police, since it often occurred in the workers’ home countries. Workers remain tied to specific employers and cannot, without permission, change jobs. And unions remain off limits. Mr. Kaabi said allowing unions would give foreign labor bosses a chokehold on the economy.
(excerpts from:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/06/world/middleeast/06dubai.html?_r=1&th&emc=th&oref=slogin)
Yes, the young soldiers of the Democratic Nations are sent into bogus Wars in order to crush the dissent, to quell the anger, to weaken the numbers of the ‘had enough’, to demolish the WILL…of those who have or potentially will feel such when they think about the PRIVILEGES of the FEW who run these oil States…our soldiers sent to divert the enemies that are growing against these EXPLOITERS & ABUSERS…those who have sold their friends and tribes and the Palestinian people down the drain over and over again…those who command Air Forces to massacre hundreds of thousands of Iraqis, many Shiites, as they streamed confused out of Kuwait…masses melted, and burnt & blown into cinder on the ‘Highway of Death’…all to preserve THE BALANCE…the security of the all mighty Sheikdoms…the UAE & Saudi Arabia & Kuwait and so on…
yes, millions will eventually die, a million already have, in order to keep the oil pumping out from these Lands of golden palaces, indoor ski slopes & ongoing exploitation…it’s enuff to make you sick.
Moral Crusaders & Money Makers & War-Mongers singing in unison to the song of ENERGY AT ALL COSTS.
Gaia help the Aboriginal people of this Southern Land.
August 8th, 2007 at 10:30 pm
Nasking,
they play rugby against their wives?
I actually agree with some of your meta-narrative, but your characterisations of people who’ve served (or played contact sports) are generally wrong, not to mention insulting to me personally.
Watch it or I’ll bring up Hitler’s diet again
Goes for you too Ken. Debnam and Brough are, I believe, the first elected ex-servies in the Coalition since Tim Fischer left. And while Brough is tarred by the company he keeps, Debnam was a whole other level of openly racist, fascist goon.
Phill is right. We’re just back to plain old class war. Back on topic, this is why the govt now can’t get any traction: Workchoices. Their foul methods have finally and openly been turned against an electorally significant group of white people, and said govt is therefore hopefully fucked.
Haneef, while a handy bit of brown person bashing, also reminded folks that you can’t trust these fuckers as far as a vegetarian could throw Joe Hockey.
I’m quite liking these other ads our corporate betters have just put on the tele too, especially the ridiculous closed shop front with the scrawl about “union bosses” on it. It’ll hopefully remind folks who pays for the “Liberal” Party, and why.
August 9th, 2007 at 12:10 am
and as they punish their bikes and legs and wives…and friends in Rugby on the oval…
better Sean…:)
you know i’m referring to Rugby Union…tho plenty of devious money makers running the League show these days.
but many a rugby league supporter…& young B-grade player & such will be drawn into their WAR GAMES…you only need to look at the latest Fox Sports ads to see the use of ANZAC/military-oriented icons…merged into the background…the gravity of the ads…as tho there is some GATHERING STORM that MUST BE OVERCOME.
Look at poor Pat Tillman in America…contact sports & Atheism meets…the BUSHEVIK LIES
And BTW…i played contact sports…am a big fan of Ice Hockey…was a rooter for Ali…luv grid iron as you might call it…particularly Roger Staubach & the Dallas Cowboys way back when…& have plenty of friends whose games i attended and thoroughly enjoyed at ice rinks and such…taught an aboriginal lad out West who played League & motivated him & any others who thought they could benefit from it…
I was referring to the crazed ones who would go out on the field & take their angst & Crusades out on the opposition…sometimes their mates in training. Seen it plenty of times. As i’m sure you have.
anyhow, the discussion of rugby brings back memories of one of my all-time fave films…Lindsay Anderson’s ‘This Sporting Life’ w/ the ever charming but always pint swilling, pub going Richard Harris…whose acting i miss dearly:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWYBxCrK8Jc&mode=related&search=
(Richard Harris ‘Cunt’ clip)
swim below the surface & ye shall find
P.S. Im a vegetarian…& i’m sure i could throw Joe Hockey further than you Sean…lol. All 150 kilos of me. Bears enjoy throwing.
August 9th, 2007 at 11:06 pm
See yer doing it again, re Tillman. Now, I do not believe that “the world changed on 11 9-11″, except insofar as authoritarians saw an opportunity and came up up with the catch all slogan “the world changed on 9-11!” But certainly the United States was attacked by an organised group which enjoyed the protection of a de-facto national govt. Many people, myself and the owner of this blog included, believe that action against the Taliban and the Al-Qaeda leadership then located in Afghanistan was warranted. It’s a rational position. That’s what Tillman signed on for and there’s no evidence that he was a dupe of the subsequent lies because of some emotional retardation or something.
-You Know Who. I reckon Tillman was a patriot.
And ya know, in 29 years of both codes of rugby, I’ve only met 2 of those idiots you mention. One I used to see at the gym and I suspect was on the gear. The other just had his eyes too far apart, know what I mean - he’d have been playing grade if he didn’t lose his rag and give away a penalty for every break he made.
150kg? Jesus man! Are you 6′8″ or do you fry all your egg plants?
August 10th, 2007 at 1:37 am
do you mean the Taliban elements that offered to hand Bin Laden over? might’ve been a good idea to have taken them up on the offer eh?
or the Taliban who tried to wipe out the opium trade that is now flourishing? I’ve noted that totalitarian governments have a tendency at some point to try and outlaw anything that brings pleasure…& possibly addiction…they trend towards Prohibition and such. Moral Crusaders trying to control every eventuality.
or the Taliban Government that was recognised by Pakistan in 1997 as the legitimate rulers of Afghanistan? how things change eh? but i guess that’s because Musharraf is such a believer in Democracy these days?
or the Taliban leadership that tried to do a pipeline deal w/ the Americans?
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/oil.html
“In 1998, Dick Cheney, now US vice-president but then chief executive of a major oil services company, remarked: “I cannot think of a time when we have had a region emerge as suddenly to become as strategically significant as the Caspian.” But the oil and gas there is worthless until it is moved. The only route which makes both political and economic sense is through Afghanistan.” [Guardian]
and
“Is an Oil Pipeline Behind the War in Afghanistan?
by Bill Sardi
Testimony before the US Congress is circulating on the internet. It pertains to a proposed oil pipeline through Central Asia that is applicable to the current war in Afghanistan.
On February 12, 1998, John J. Maresca, vice president, international relations for UNOCAL oil company, testified before the US House of Representatives, Committee on International Relations. Maresca provided information to Congress on Central Asia oil and gas reserves and how they might shape US foreign policy. UNOCAL’s problem? As Maresca said: “How to get the region’s vast energy resources to the markets.” The oil reserves are in areas north of Afghanistan, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Kazakhstan and Russia. Routes for a pipeline were proposed that would transport oil on a 42-inch pipe southward thru Afghanistan for 1040 miles to the Pakistan coast. Such a pipeline would cost about $2.5 billion and carry about 1 million barrels of oil per day.
Maresca told Congress then that: “It’s not going to be built until there is a single Afghan government. That’s the simple answer.”
Dana Rohrbacher, California congressman, then identified the Taliban as the ruling controllers among various factions in Afghanistan and characterized them as “opium producers.”
Then Rohrbacher asked Maresca: “There is a Saudi terrorist who is infamous for financing terrorism around the world. Is he in the Taliban area or is he up there with the northern people?”
Maresca answered: “If it is the person I am thinking of, he is there in the Taliban area.” This testimony obviously alluded to Osama bin Laden.
Then Rorhbacher asked: “… in the northern area as compared to the place where the Taliban are in control, would you say that one has a better human rights record toward women than the other?”
Maresca responded by saying: “With respect to women, yes. But I don’t think either faction here has a very clean human rights record, to tell you the truth.”
So women’s rights were introduced into Congressional testimony by Congressman Rohrbacher as the wedge for UNOCAL to build its pipeline through Afghanistan. Three years later CNN would be airing its acclaimed TV documentary “Under The Veil,” which displayed the oppressive conditions that women endure in Afghanistan under the rule of the Taliban (a propaganda film for the oil pipeline?).
Rohrbacher then went on to say that a democratic election should take place in Afghanistan and “if the Taliban are not willing to make that kind of commitment, I would be very hesitant to move foreward on a $2.5 billion investment because without that commitment, I don’t think there is going to be any tranquility in that land.”
Beginning in 1998 UNOCAL was chastized, particularly by women’s rights groups, for discussions with the Taliban, and headed in retreat as a worldwide effort mounted to come to the defense of the Afghani women. This forced UNOCAL to withdraw from its talks with the Taliban and dissolve its multinational partnership in that region. In 1999 Alexander’s Gas & Oil Connections newsletter said: “UNOCAL company officials said late last year (1998) they were abandoning the project because of the need to cut costs in the Caspian region and because of the repeated failure of efforts to resolve the long civil conflict in Afghanistan.” [Volume 4, issue #20 - Monday, November 22, 1999]
Three days following the attack on the World Trade Centers in New York City, UNOCAL issued a statement reconfirming it had withdrawn from its project in Afghanistan, long before recent events. [www.unocal.com September 14, 2001 statement]
UNOCAL was not the only party positioning themselves to tap into oil and gas reserves in central Asia. UNOCAL was primary member of a multinational consortium called CentGas (Central Asia Gas) along with Delta Oil Company Limited (Saudi Arabia), the Government of Turkmenistan, Indonesia Petroleum, LTD. (INPEX) (Japan), ITOCHU Oil Exploration Co., Ltd. (Japan), Hyundai Engineering & Construction Co., Ltd. (Korea), the Crescent Group (Pakistan) and RAO Gazprom (Russia).
Just because CentGas had dissolved does not mean that the involved parties have totally abandoned their interest in building an oil pipeline out of Central Asia. There is also talk of another pipeline thru Iran. India and Pakistan are bidding to be the pipeline terminal ocean port since they would obtain hundreds of millions of dollars in fees.
So, in 1998 Osama bin Laden was identified as the villain behind the Taliban, Afghanistani women the victims of an oppressive Taliban regime, and the stage was set for a future stabilization effort (i.e. a war). Was all this a cover story for a future oil pipeline?
In November 2000, Bruce Hoffman, director of the Rand Institute office in Washington DC, indicated that the next US President would have to face up to the growing threat is Islamic terrorism. Hoffman: “The next administration must turn its immediate attention to knitting together the full range of US counterterrorist capabilities into a cohesive plan.” [Los Angeles Times, November 12, 2000]
All that was needed was a triggering event.
October 15, 2001
(Lew Rockwell .com)
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Personally, i reckon the Taliban leadership & their cronies were a despicable group…their horrendous treatment of women…constant abuse of civil rights…use of kangaroo courts…blowing up of religious icons that didn’t fit their own beliefs…bunch of ruthless, moral crusading dickheads…but…that didn’t lead to anything but agreements w/ neighbours & some companies…
but once they were considered as harboring the ever vanishing al-Qaeda…potentially the instigators of the 9/11 attacks…then the sh*t comes down…
but does a horrific, violent act inflicted upon innocents in America justify unleashing a wholesale fire storm from above?…& the killing of many innocent Afghani civilians in the process?…& laying areas with cluster bombs considering Afghanistan’s tragic history of landmine victims…?
i guess it does when your lack of security causes problems for laying pipelines…or you share a border w/ oil rich nations.
When you think about it…it’s a wonder that anyone who knew that total paranoid freak & terrorist Timothy McVeigh, the Oklahoma City bomber, anyone who associated w/ him in the years prior to that dreadful event…or supported his actions, or people he read about…or people he fired guns with etc…weren’t blasted into oblivion or kept in some kind of prison camp & interrogated for years.
You’d think there would’ve been a WAR ON DOMESTIC TERRORISM…w/ terror alerts racing across the TV…& running, panicked commentary on dangerous militias & gun owners & bomb manual writers & so on…w/ multi-billions spent on surveillance of American citizens…
but i guess it took a bunch of outsiders, primarily Saudis, to motivate that eh?
August 10th, 2007 at 8:32 am
oh, & Sean, I won’t be pulled into a discussion of Nationalism vs. Patriotism…the demand by some that we “argue over whether our Governments are using ‘faux’, distorted Patriotism or ‘true Patriotism” ruse is being used everywhere to pull Pacifists & Anti-Warists into stating that a TRUE PATRIOT would serve & defend their Nation & therefore the ELITE should also be sent to War…& eventually this could lead to a demand by the populace (tricked citizenry) that legislation be passed (such as some in the American Democratic Party have introduced) that calls for ‘conscription without discrimination’ (so to speak)… sure, Orwell has some interesting quotes on the distinction between ‘Patriotism’ & ‘Nationalism’…as does Paul Keating…but, there is no freakin’ way i’m going to be duped into supporting another draft just to get the privileged FEW’s kids over to Iraq…not this fella. Tho granted, you may have had a more innocent intention. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt being a RTS regular…:)
BOGUS WAR. FIASCO!
As for Pat Tillman, he did what he thought was right…he came from a Nation that uses pro-military indoctrination techniques thruout kid’s lives in some communities…& when you take into account the post 9/11 propaganda pushed by some media outlets & authority figures…the unrelenting call to arms…and accusations of being ‘unpatriotic’ pointed at any critics of the War on Terror or the American Federal Govt….& the distortion of events & origins of the perpetrators…it’s not surprising a young man might feel he is serving his Country by joining up…a man, Tillman, whose own army let him down…& his Government covered up & lied about the circumstances to use him as a recruitment poster boy.
Disgraceful!
So try not to spin my words Sean and make out i was stating he was retarded, brain damaged or such.
in addition, i have no problem w/ those from a military background serving as politicians (my Grandfather served in WW1, was mustard gassed, had the shakes from that point on, but went on to became the Mayor of Benfleet/Canvey Island in England)…the more diverse the Government benches the better imho…but i have a problem w/ politicians using the army inappropriately, those who seem to allow their allegiance to the military to undermine their role to respect the civil rights of those they represent…when by their overt actions they give the perception they have put aside the NEED to abide by the tenets & principles of a Democracy…& begin to make many in the Country wary of their motives & suspect of their long-term intentions, then they deserve to be criticised and scrutinised. I feel this way about Mal Brough, as do MANY others in this Country.
BTW, if anyone attacks these shores i’ll be prepared to defend it…but these days i reckon the enemy is starting to grow from within…& it comes from diverse roots…& unfortunately religion is playing a major role in the drive behind these various groups & individuals. Democracy is in peril.
P.S. i’ll drop the Rugby references too…unless i think someone related to the game(s) is conning the Nation…but do remember this…i spent years in the UK too…& came across more than a few arrogant, holier than thou, kooky toffs who dug Rugby Union. I’m glad to hear the same doesn’t apply here. At least from your perspective eh?
And nuthin’ to do w/ class wars either…moral crusaders & deceitful bastards come from all walks of life…as do philanthropists & compassionate types.
Thinking out loud: Tho i still wonder what category we’d put Elliot Ness & Serpico in…moral crusaders or corruption busters serving Democracy & the People? (all becomes a bit gray sometimes the more you learn, read & listen). Thanx for the discussion…:)